Friday, August 21, 2015

SECTION 19 - The Case for Jordan as the Best Perimeter Defender of All-Time




I think Jordan is the greatest perimeter defender of all-time. Many other players are also in the discussion - the main ones being Scottie Pippen, Gary Payton, and Dennis Rodman, but I think Jordan was superior to all of them as a perimeter defender. 

Before we begin, it should be understood that stats such as DBPM, Drtg, and Dwin shares are not accurate for measuring individual defense. There are far more accurate ways to measure individual defense, which will be explored in this article especially with regards to Jordan's Wizard years before his knee injury.

In the playoffs, Charlie Ward is top 15 in Drtg over Kevin Garnett, and Greg Ostertag and Anderson Varejao are top 25 ahead of Dwight Howard, Kahwi Leonard, Dennis Rodman, Hakeem, Tony Allen, Mutombo, and more. DPBM is another irrelevant stat. In the playoffs, according to DBPM, Marcus Camby and Greg Ostertag are top 3 defenders of all time over Hakeem, David Robinson, Mutombo, Dwight Howard, Garnett, Duncan and many more players that they are not close to defensively.

As more proof of how useless these stats are for evaluating defense, Ron Artest never was top 10 in DBPM or Drtg in any of his seasons in the league, and only once was he top 10 in Dwin shares at 7th in 2003/04 during his DPOY season. This is despite the fact that Ron Artest is considered arguably the best perimeter defender of his era. Clearly these stats are not to be trusted at all when it comes to evaluating defense, since apparently Ron Artest was never a top 10 defender in the league according to these stats, with the exception of Dwin shares in 2003/04.

Anyways, here are the reasons why Jordan has a rock solid case as the best perimeter defender of all-time

1. Playoff Defense and 1-1 Matchups

There probably is not another perimeter player who took on as many tough matchups in the playoffs as Jordan did. There is a misconception that Pippen was the guy who always guarded the other team's best player in the playoffs, because of the famous story when Pippen switched on Magic in Game 2 of the Finals and did a great job. But in the very next game, Game 3 of the 1991 Finals, Pippen fouled out at the end of the 4th quarter and after Magic had lit up Jordan + Pippen through 4 quarters, Jordan shut down Magic to 0-0-0 with 1 turnover in the OT.

In fact, Jordan had an elite defensive performance in every single one of his NBA Finals, including that Game 3 against Magic.

1992 Finals - Drexler, a top 5 SG of all-time, had 25 ppg on a poor 40.7% FG in the 1992 Finals after 25 ppg on 47% in the regular season, and most of his points came in transition or on other defenders when Jordan was not guarding him. Jordan completely locked him down. Jordan also shut down 
Terry Porter, who averaged 21.6 PPG with 52% FG and 47% 3PT in the 1992 Playoffs. He is the only player to average at least 15 PPG on 50% FG and 45% 3PT in an NBA Finals run (min. 1.5 3PA/game).

1993 Finals, Game 3 - Kevin Johnson scored 23 points before Jordan guarded him with 7 minutes left in the 4th quarter. KJ had 2 points the rest of the game including the 3 overtimes. Kevin Johnson is one of 3 players in history (Oscar + Isiah) to average 20-10 for 3 straight years, and before running into Gary Payton in the 1993 WCF, KJ averaged 19.6 ppg and 9.4 apg on 53% in the 1993 Playoffs which was just short of his 20-10 mark.


Contrary to popular belief, Jordan would
taken on the tougher playoff matchups
than Pippen and did a better job
the  majority of the time
1996 Finals - With Ron Harper's knee injury limiting him to 1 minute in both Games 3 and 5, Jordan shut down Gary Payton in both Game 3 and Game 5. Payton had averaged 22-5-7-2 on 50% through 3 rounds in the 1996 Playoffs, while sweeping the 2x defending champion Rockets and beating Stockton/Malone's Jazz.

1997 and 1998 Finals - Jordan did not guard Stockton for long periods of time, as this was past his defensive peak. Jordan's off-ball was huge, however, including the Flu game in which all 3 of Jordan's steals came off of Stockton's passes.

His on-ball on Stockton was also good the few times when he did guard Stockton, and his off-ball and help defense on Karl Malone was also key, including the championship winning steal and shot in Game 6 of the 1998 Finals

And these are only the examples of Jordan's defensive performances in the NBA Finals. 
Before the Bulls title years, Jordan also repeatedly shut down Isiah Thomas who shot 39 - 41% in all 4 playoff series against the Bulls (1988, 1989, 1990, 1991). Jordan also played great defense on former 2x scoring champ Adrian Dantley in the 1988 ECSF, who averaged 20 ppg on 51% in 31 mpg for the 87/88 season.

In the 1996 ECF, Pippen spent more time guarding Penny than Jordan did, but when Jordan did guard Penny, he did a better job. Penny only scored 1 total point with Jordan guarding him in the entire 1996 ECF.

Jordan also locked down these guys when he guarded them

  • Tim Hardaway (1996 1st Rd) - averaged 17-10 on 43% in 28 games with the 1996 Heat, and 25-10 on 46% for his playoff career prior to that series.
  • Rod Strickland (1997 1st Rd) - Strickland was an underrated player who averaged 17-19 ppg and 8-10 apg at his best, and even led the league in assists in 97/98.
  • Steve Smith (1997 ECSF) - averaged 20 ppg on 43% in 96/97
And in 1998, with the season on the line against Indiana in Game 7 of the 98 ECF, Jordan was the one who had to guard Reggie Miller in the 4th quarter. Reggie had 22 points on 7/12 (58%) FG through 3 quarters, then Jordan switched on him in the 4th and Reggie had 0 points and was only able to attempt 1 shot.

Here is an incomplete list of notable offensive matchups Jordan guarded in the playoffs


Isiah Thomas - 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991
Charles Barkley - 1990 (brief stretches)
Magic Johnson - 1991
James Worthy - 1991 (brief stretches)
Clyde Drexler - 1992
Terry Porter - 1992
Kevin Johnson - 1993
Tim Hardaway - 1996
Gary Payton - 1996
Rod Strickland - 1997
Steve Smith - 1997
Reggie Miller - 1998
John Stockton - 1997, 1998 (brief stretches)

In every NBA Finals, Jordan guarded a top 5 or top 10 all-time PG or SG
- Magic Johnson
- Clyde Drexler
Kevin Johnson
- Gary Payton
- John Stockton

Rodman is a superior defender than Jordan overall and took on even tougher overall matchups than Jordan in the playoffs

But if we're talking strictly perimeter defense, Jordan was better. Rodman was better than Jordan as an overall defender because of his rebounding and arguably the best post-defense of all time along with Russell + Hakeem, and doing all that while also being a top-5 all-time perimeter defender at his best in his Pistons days.

But after leaving the Spurs in 1995, Rodman became exclusively a post-defender, and therefore putting him behind Jordan as a perimeter defender, because he didn't have to defend the perimeter for as long as Jordan did.


Rodman was a superior defender than
Jordan overall because of his post-defense
and rebounding, but if we are looking purely
at perimeter defense, Jordan has the edge.

After leaving San Antonio, Rodman had
no defensive responsibility on the perimeter.
Pippen is a top-5 perimeter defender, but contrary to popular belief (mostly based on Game 2 of the 1991 Finals) Jordan took on more difficult matchups at a higher rate than Pippen in the playoffs, and most of the time did a better job. Even though Pippen did a better job on Magic Johnson in Game 2 of the 1991 Finals, Jordan came right back the next game and shut down Magic across the board in OT (0-0-0 with 1 TO) after Pippen fouled out in the 4th quarter. And as mentioned in the Penny Hardaway example, Pippen guarded him more often, but Jordan did better in the stretches he switched on Penny.

Pippen was more versatile since he could guard 1-4, but versatility doesn't necessarily mean better defense. Anthony Mason was more versatile than Jordan and Payton since he could guard 2-5, but that doesn't automatically make him a superior defender. Versatility is only one aspect of defense, not the deciding factor. 


Jordan finished ahead of Pippen in DPOY voting in
- 1988, 1989, 1990, 1993, 1998

Jordan tied with Pippen in DPOY voting in
- 1991 and 1992

Pippen finished ahead of Jordan in DPOY voting in
- 1996 and 1997

In their 9 seasons together
- MJ finished ahead of Pippen 5 times in DPOY voting
- Pippen and MJ tied 2 times in DPOY voting
- Pippen finished ahead of MJ 2 times in DPOY voting

Despite Jordan missing most of his 2nd year due to injury and taking 2 prime years off afterwards.

Jordan has more
- DPOY (1 to 0)
- Top 5 finishes in DPOY (7 to 5)
- Top 8 finishes in DPOY (10 to 8)
- Steals titles (3 to 1)
- All Defense 1st Team (9 to 8)

Jordan and Pippen tied for
- Top 2 finishes in DPOY (2)
- Top 3 finishes in DPOY (3)

Jordan has always been regarded as the better defender than Pippen for their overall careers. Only after their careers ended did revisionism start the myth that Pippen was the better defender and guarded top threats more often.

This myth mainly stems from Pippen switching onto Magic in Game 2 of the 1991 Finals, yet many people who believe this myth as a result of that game don't even realize that Jordan was still the primary defender on Magic Johnson in the other 4 games and still had success
- Holding Magic to 0-0-0 with 2 TOs in OT of Game 3
- Causing all 6 of Magic's TOs in Game 5 and forcing others that were not credited to Magic himself.

To seal the deal as to who was the better defender between Jordan and Pippen, one only has to look at Game 7 of the 1998 ECF. With the season on the line in Game 7, Jordan was the one that guarded the Pacer's best player, red-hot Reggie Miller who had 22 points on 7/12 through 3 quarters, before getting shut down to 0 points in the 4th quarter by Jordan. If Pippen really was the better defender than Jordan, then Phil would have put his trust in letting Pippen shut down Reggie in the 4th quarter with the entire season on the line. But that wasn't the case.
Payton also took on a lot of tough matches in the Playoffs and did a great job on most of them
In terms of taking on tough playoff matchups and doing a great job on them, Payton doesn't look too far behind Jordan. But the next section is where I feel Jordan has a big edge over Payton, as well as Pippen and Rodman (strictly at perimeter-defense)

2. Longevity, Consistency and Team Defensive Impact

Jordan was an elite defender from the 1986/87 season through the first 46 games of the 2001/02 season before his knee injury with the Wizards. That's 10 full seasons and a half season in 01/02 over the course of 15 years
(not including 94/95 - 17 game season, 27 including playoffs)

In 1986/87, Jordan did not make the defensive team but he became one of 3 players with 200 steals + 100 blocks in a season. The other two are Pippen and Hakeem, both of whom are arguably the greatest defensive players at their positions. Jordan had 2.9 spg and 1.5 bpg in 1986/87, making him the first player with 2.5+ spg and 1.5+ bpg in a season. Hakeem is the only other player to do that in a full season (1988/89), although Gerald Wallace did that for 55 games in 2005/06. Jordan was number 2 in the league in steals per game and number 1 among perimeter players in blocks per game. Granted, steals and blocks are not the end-all be-all but it says a lot that Hakeem is the only other player to match Jordan's steals-blocks averages in a season. At the very least, Jordan was more deserving of defensive team honors than 2nd team Derek Harper, Mo Cheeks, and Paul Pressey, and first team Dennis Johnson.

In 1987/88, Jordan won DPOY and with a rookie Pippen averaging 21 mpg, the Bulls allowed the least points in the league. Jordan once again had 200 steals + 100 blocks in the season, making him the only player to do that twice. We just went over all the great defensive jobs Jordan did in the playoffs from 1988 to 1998, so there's no need to go over that again. But it is worth nothing that Pippen missed half the 1997/98 season, but with Jordan + Rodman, the Bulls were still a top 3 defense in the league despite missing Pippen for so long. 

This is why the 1994 Bulls' defensive success without Jordan cannot be used against him. When you have 1 or 2 all-time great defenders on the same team, the team will still be great defensively even after losing one or the other. The Bulls were great defensively after Jordan left in 1993, and they were still great defensively when Pippen missed half the 98 season - showing that both Jordan and Pippen could make up for the other's absence on D.

and 
Jordan still had an enormous impact defensively, even as a Wizard at age 38 and with multiple injuries entering the season 
Jordan dominated defensively both 1 on 1 and team-wise before his knee injury against the Kings in his 46th game as a Wizard. Let's look at his 1-1 defense first.
  • Locking down Peja Stojakovic (21 ppg on 48% for the 01/02 season) in the Feb 7, 2002 game in which Jordan's knee injury happened. Peja did not score on Jordan until after the knee injury happened.
Even as a 38-year old Wizard,
Jordan locked down multiple
star players and had enormous
team defensive impact.
  • And even three games after his knee injury, Jordan was still able to shut down Shawn Marion, who averaged 19.1 ppg on 47% that season. Marion did not score until late in the 1st half and did not score on Jordan until midway through the 3rd quarter. Marion had only 4 points on Jordan.
These examples are only through 46 games in the 01/02 season and the ones that I have footage and newspaper articles to back them up, so there very well be more that I have not discovered. And if not for his injury we could have seen many more great defensive performances by Jordan in the remainder of the season.

What seals Jordan case for the greatest perimeter defender of all-time in my opinion is how he impacted the Wizards team defense as a whole before his injury.

2001 Wizards = 2nd worst in ppg allowed the year before.

Up to the injury game
2002 Wizards = allowed 92.2 ppg through 47 games (Jordan missed 1 game)
- would be tied for 6th-best in the league with the Pistons.

2002 Wizards = allowed 92.0 ppg in the 46 games Jordan played
- would be tied for 5th best in the league with the Nets

After Jordan's injury
2002 Wizards = allowed 96.8 ppg in the remaining 35 games
- would be ranked 19th in the league
- and fell to 11th in ppg allowed for the overall season.

The Wizards were 2nd worst in ppg allowed the previous year with Rip Hamilton playing 78 games. The Wizards were on track to be top 5 in ppg allowed through the first 46 games Jordan played, and that was with Rip Hamilton missing 5 weeks (last week of December and almost all of January)

Considering that Rip played almost the entire 2nd half of the season after Jordan's injury, Jordan's defensive impact is even greater than what the above numbers show us.

and like Jordan's offensive numbers, Jordan's defensive impact was improving as the season went on before his injury

The Wizards started the season off slow with a 2-9 start
- and allowed 98.4 ppg during the 2-9 start
- on pace for 5th worst in the league

In Jordan's last 35 games pre-injury after the 2-9 start
- the Wizards allowed 90.0 ppg
- on pace for 3rd best in the league

When Jordan and Rip Hamilton played together, 
they were 15-1 in their last 16 games together up to the injury 

- The Wizards allowed 86.3 ppg in that 15-1 stretch
- Easily on pace for the best in the league
- The 2002 Heat were number 1 at 88.7 ppg allowed

Rip played 78 games the previous year and the Wizards were still 2nd worst in ppg allowed. Had Jordan and Hamilton played a full, healthy season together, Jordan could potentially have taken the Wizards from 2nd worst to the best defense in the league in ppg allowed, and with Jordan being the only major addition to the player roster. 


Think about that for a second. A 38 year old hobbled Jordan being the only major addition to a team that would have gone from 2nd worst to number 1 in ppg allowed if not for injuries. Can you think of any other perimeter player who could have that type of defensive impact at that late a stage of their career? There are even very few big men or rim protectors who could have done so.


Outside of Jordan, the 2002 Wizards' only new additions were 5 bench players, 4 of whom where rookies that played very little minutes  
- Tyronn Lue (20 mpg)
- Rookie Kwame Brown (14 mpg)
- Rookie Brendan Haywood (14 mpg)
- Rookie Etan Thomas (13 mpg)
- Rookie Bobby Simmons (11 mpg)
Pippen was still elite defensively
with the Blazers, but did not
have the defensive responsibilities
that Wizards Jordan did pre-injury,
both team-wise and in terms of
guarding the other team's top player.


Jordan was the only new player on the 2002 team that had a significant impact and played significant minutes.


The Wizards did add coach Doug Collins, but after Jordan's injury, the Wizards allowed 96.8 ppg in the remaining 35 games with Rip Hamilton playing almost all those games, which would be ranked 19th in the league. So Collin's impact on the defense as coach was negligible compared to Jordan's as a player, especially considering Jordan was anchoring the defense without Rip Hamilton for 5 weeks through the first 46 games (missed 1 game) whereas Collins had Rip for the majority of the remaining 35 games. And Jordan still played 14 games after his injury as well, they would have been even worse on defense post-injury had Jordan not played those 14 games.

Under Jordan's defensive leadership, the 2002 Wizards were also great at holding opponent's to low FG%

The 2001 Wizards' opponents shot 47.0%, 3rd worst in the league

Through their first 47 games pre-Jordan's injury (Jordan missed 1 game)
- The 2002 Wizards' opponents shot 44.3%
- on pace for 11th best in the league

In the 35 games post-Jordan's injury
- The 2002 Wizards' opponents shot 46.4%
- on pace for 2nd worst in the league (0.0001% worse than the Suns)

And under Jordan, the Wizards improved on holding opponents to low FG% as the season went on

Wizards got off to a slow 2-9 start to begin the season
- The Wizards' opponents shot 46.8%
- on pace for worst in the league

In the Wizards last 36 games pre-Jordan injury (Jordan missed 1 game)
- The Wizards' opponents shot 43.6%
- on pace for 8th best in the league

The Wizards were 15-1 in the last 16 games that Jordan and Rip Hamilton played together prior to Jordan's knee injury
- The Wizards' opponents shot 41.7% in that 15-1 stretch
- Easily on pace for best in the league
- The 2002 Lakers held opponents to a league best 42.4%

Remember, Rip played 78 games the previous year and the Wizards were still 3rd worst in the league in opponent FG%. When Jordan and Rip played together, they were easily the best, and Jordan was the only major addition to the roster.

Jordan also had a huge impact on his team's rebounding, even though he was only third on the team in rpg

2002 Wizards = 43.27 rpg through 47 games pre-injury
(MJ missed 1 game)
- on pace for 9th best in the league

2002 Wizards = 43.39 rpg through 46 games that MJ played pre-injury
- on pace for 8th best in the league

2002 Wizards = 40.40 rpg in 35 games post-injury
- on pace for 4th worst in the league
- fell to 18th in rebounding for the overall season

and Jordan's impact on rebounding was also improving as the season went on

Wizards got off to a slow 2-9 start to begin the season
- averaged 40.36 rpg in that stretch 
- on pace for 4th worst in the league

In Jordan's last 35 games pre-injury
- the Wizards averaged 44.34 rpg 
- on pace for 3rd best in the league

Jordan was only 3rd on the team in rpg, but for whatever reason, his presence alone still made the Wizards an elite rebounding team, and they were a poor rebounding team without him. As the only notable addition, a 38-year old Jordan with crippled knees and cracked ribs singlehandedly transformed the Wizards from a poor rebounding and defensive team to an elite one. You will never find a perimeter defender that dominated both team-wise and 1 on 1 at that late a stage of their career. In fact, there are very few defenders in general, including big men, who can maintain that level of defensive impact for so long.

As mentioned earlier, Rodman was no longer a perimeter defender after 1995, so only about half of his career was devoted to perimeter defense whereas Jordan was elite on the perimeter nearly his entire career up to his Wizards injury. Again, Rodman is better as an overall defender, but not strictly as a perimeter defender.

Pippen is comparable to Jordan in terms of longevity, but as we saw earlier, Jordan took on the tougher playoff matchups when they were teammates. Pippen was also a great defender in Portland, but his focus in Portland was moreso on help and team defense rather than on locking down the other teams best player. Even in Washington, Jordan had to and did shut down the other teams' top scoring threats multiple times while also impacting the team's defense at the same time, and on a worse team than what Pippen had in Portland
(The Blazers made the 1999 WCF with a top 10 defense the year before Pippen got there)
Payton was a great defender for a long
time, but his defense tailed off from
2000-2003 whereas Jordan did not miss a
beat defensively since 1987, even after
coming off a 3 year layoff

Payton had longevity, but was not as consistent on defense as Jordan because he tailed off for a few years defensively from 2000 to 2003 despite his defensive accolades.
  • 37-year old Stockton put up 13-12 on 51% against Payton in the 2000 Playoffs 
  • Payton shut down rookie Tony Parker in 3/5 games in the 2002 Playoffs, but Parker also put up huge numbers on Payton in the other 2 games, showing that Payton was not as consistent as he used to be
To his credit, Payton did shut down Parker when they met again in the 2004 WCSF at age 35, and did a great job on Billups and Hamilton in 2006 at age 37. However, Jordan was a threat defensively from age 23 to 38 (pre-injury), and he impacted the Wizards' team defense greater than Payton did in his last years with Seattle.

For being able to dominate in all aspects of perimeter defense, and being able to dominate in more perimeter defensive areas for longer periods of time than the other GOAT perimeter defender candidates

  • Playoffs
  • Tough 1-1 matchups 
  • On-ball
  • Off-ball
  • Longevity
  • Team impact
Until someone can
  • Lock down as many 20+ ppg scorers/Hall of Famers in the playoffs
  • Continue shutting down 20+ and 25+ ppg scorers at age 38 (Peja, Vince, Pierce)
  • Singlehandedly turn around a top 2 or 3 worst defense to a top 5 best defense (and number 1 when playing with Rip) as the only major addition, at age 38
Jordan has a rock-solid case as the best perimeter defensive player of all-time, along with being the best offensive player of all-time.





In Jordan's era, there were no 2nd/3rd place votes for DPOY prior to 2002/03. That makes his defensive resume even more impressive, since he did it entirely off of 1st place votes alone.


Jordan finished ahead of Pippen in DPOY voting in
- 1988, 1989, 1990, 1993, 1998

Jordan tied with Pippen in DPOY voting in
- 1991 and 1992

Pippen finished ahead of Jordan in DPOY voting in
- 1996 and 1997

In their 9 seasons together
- MJ finished ahead of Pippen 5 times in DPOY voting
- Pippen and MJ tied 2 times in DPOY voting
- Pippen finished ahead of MJ 2 times in DPOY voting

Despite Jordan missing most of his 2nd year due to injury and taking 2 prime years off afterwards. Jordan has more
- DPOY (1 to 0)
- Top 5 finishes in DPOY (7 to 5)
- Top 8 finishes in DPOY (10 to 8)
- Steals titles (3 to 1)
- All Defense 1st Team (9 to 8)

Jordan and Pippen tied for
- Top 2 finishes in DPOY (2)
- Top 3 finishes in DPOY (3)

Jordan has always been regarded as the better defender than Pippen for their overall careers. Only after their careers ended did revisionism start the myth that Pippen was the better defender and guarded top threats more often. 

Quotes on Michael Jordan's defense

"I think Michael realized that by stepping up and putting a lot more pressure on Magic, and I think that's why Phil stuck with Michael because he was able to put a lot more pressure than what he did in Game 1"
- Scottie Pippen after the 1991 Finals - confirming that Jordan primarily defended Magic for the series 

I would probably call him the ultimate weapon on the basketball court. Offensively, defensively, inspirationally.
- Julius Erving, 1993

I don't think there's any flaws in this guy's game. He's the best defensive player in the league, in my opinion.
- Jerry West, 1993


"...Michael Jordan's presence on both ends of the court, that's a real special package to have in one player"
- Jerry West, 1996

"He's not only a factor on the offensive end, but the defensive end I think he's nearly as great, and everything he does offensively overshadows his incredible defensive abilities that he has"
- Jerry West, 1996

"To me, the better part of his game is his defense. He becomes very intense and disrupts in the same manner that K.C. Jones did for the Celtics," Chamberlain said. "There are guys who play Jordan who are afraid to put the ball down and afraid to pass. They're always looking and saying, 'Where the hell is Michael?' He'll steal the ball or cause you to do something you don't want to do. But Michael understands that we have always loved numbers and scoring and the point system. The people who score the touchdowns or score the baskets are the guys who get all the applause."
- NY Daily News, November 3, 1996

He's met every challenge ever put in front of him, he plays great defense.
- Red Auerbach, February 1998

And he kept taking on all comers. He gave you 30 points a night, he gave you defense, he gave you attitude.
- Red Auerbach, January 1999

Michael has the most talent in every aspect of the game, even defense.
- Dave Bing, January 1999

The whole package. He's scary sometimes with his defense.
- Billy Cunningham, January 1999

He wanted to be known not only as a great scorer and a winner, but a great defender. And he was. As good as Chicago was offensively, they were better defensively primarily because of Michael Jordan.”
- Dave Cowens, January 1999

He does everything well. He’s great offensively and defensively. What else would you want a guy to do?
- George Mikan, January 1999

Michael’s definitely the best basketball player of all time. He’s the greatest offensive weapon to ever play, and probably the best defensive player we’ve ever seen.
- Shaquille O'Neal, January 1999

He has the complete package in all facets of his offensive game, and when you break him down defensively, he’s also the best defensive player in the game... He should be remembered as the greatest of all time.
- Isiah Thomas, January 1999

I don't believe Michael was the greatest shooter or the greatest dribbler or passer or the greatest defensive player, etc. However, I believe he could do all these things better than anyone else who ever played in the NBA.
- Bill Sharman, January 1999

To me he’s the best offensive player and the best defensive player in the league for a number of years. To be the defensive player of the year with all the other things he had to do, to me, he’s a marvel.
- Jerry West, January 1999

He could break through virtually any screen and shut down almost any player with his intense, laser-focused style of defense.
- Phil Jackson, May 2013

He has the ability to do what a Michael Jordan did at both ends. I don’t mean he’s Michael Jordan, but Michael played both ends of the floor.
- Gregg Popovich, November 2015
- Comparing Kawhi Leonard's 2-way play to Jordan

“Michael Jordan always took it to a point that he wanted to guard the best player even with myself, even if I start talking trash to him he would always tell Scottie Pippen ‘look, I’m taking Gary tonight...


He would always take the best basketball player...Michael Jordan really had a mindset of ‘I don’t care how much I do tire myself out, I’m gonna go and take this guy because I want to prove to him that I am the better basketball player’.
- Gary Payton, June 2018


Sources for quotes
- 1
- 2
- 3


Jordan did all this while playing in the most stacked era at the guard position defensively.

All Guards who won DPOY
Sidney Moncrief - 1983 and 1984
Alvin Robertson - 1986
Michael Cooper - 1987
Michael Jordan - 1988
Gary Payton - 1996

All Guards who were 2nd place in DPOY
Sidney Moncrief - 1985
Alvin Robertson - 1987
Michael Jordan - 1993
Gary Payton - 1997 and 1998

All Guards who were 3rd place in DPOY
Maurice Cheeks - 1983
Michael Cooper - 1983
Dennis Johnson - 1984
Sidney Moncrief - 1986
Joe Dumars - 1990
Derek Harper - 1990
Alvin Robertson - 1991
Michael Jordan - 1992
Mookie Blaylock - 1997
Eddie Jones - 2000
Kobe Bryant - 2002
Dwyane Wade - 2009

Paul Pressey and Shane Battier were 3rd place in 1985 and 2008 DPOY voting, respectively. According to Basketball-Reference, however, these players were listed as SFs for those respective seasons and not as SGs.

Including Jordan himself, all 5 guards that have won DPOY and/or came 2nd place in DPOY competed in Jordan's era (1984/85 - 1997/98).
- 13 Guards in NBA history have come at least top 3 in DPOY voting
- 11 of 13 (85%) played multiple seasons in Jordan's era (1984/85 - 1997/98) as full-time starters.
- This excludes Kobe and Wade and includes Jordan himself.


More 


Looking at how the Jordan Era players had an easier time in the modern era
- Looking at how a 38-40 year old Jordan himself schooled the 2000s defenders

SECTION 3 - Jordan's "Weak" Defensive Competition Compared to Lebron/Kobe's "Advanced" Competition

- Proving the vast superiority of individual defenders of Jordan's era compared to the 2000s
- Destroying the myth that Jordan never played zone defense
- Proof that 80s/90s players would still have success guarding 2000s players without the 80s/90s rules
- Looking at how Jordan did against the 80s teams and why expansion did not make it easier to win championships
- Proof that Jordan's Competition was 80s-quality and far better than the 2000s era
- Looking at the truth of how the Bulls did without Jordan, and how other great teams did without their stars.
- Did Jordan really get any more special treatment than other superstars? Nope.
- Exposing the myths behind the great, but misunderstood, Wilt Chamberlain
- Looking at how Lebron got locked down by defenders of the 2000s era and comparing them to the vastly superior 80s/90s
- Destroying one of the media's biggest misconceptions regarding Lebron's solid but vastly overrated defense
- Lebron fans think no player in history could succeed if their teammates don't step up, and that Lebron is the only one who has carried a team on his back. Is that really the case?
- The real Jordan vs Lebron comparison
- The real Jordan vs Kobe comparison
- Kareem is great, but he is not even the greatest center of all-time, let alone the greatest of all-time.
- The full context behind Jordan's struggles without Pippen
- A look at how Jordan turned the Wizards around before his knee injury caught up to him

- Looking at Jordan's defensive impact in detail, both as a team player and 1 on 1 defender

- Looking at the strong evidence supporting that Jordan would have achieved more than what LeBron has in Cleveland and Miami 

SECTION 21 - Hakeem Olajuwon: The Greatest Center of All-Time
- Hakeem Olajuwon is the best center of all-time, and there is strong evidence to prove it


SECTION 22 - Chris Paul: The Most Overrated Point Guard Of All-Time

- Chris Paul is an extremely overrated playoff performer and defender, and isn't even a top 5 PG of his own era, let alone all-time

SECTION 23 - Kevin Johnson: The Most Underrated Point Guard Of All-Time

- Kevin Johnson is an extremely underrated and under-appreciated point guard, who should have been a first-ballot Hall of Famer and considered a top-10 point guard of all-time

SECTION 24 - The Three Greatest Playoff Runs of All-Time
- Analyzing the three greatest individual playoff runs in NBA history

SECTION 25 - The Worst Finals Performances of All-Time
- Analyzing the worst performances in NBA Finals history

SECTION 26 - Jordan vs Russell
- Comparing the two players who won the most championships as the best player on their team

SECTION 27 - The Five Greatest Coaches of All-Time
- Taking a look at the greatest coaches in NBA history

SECTION 28 - The Least Deserving Finals MVPs of All-Time
- Taking a look at the players who least deserved to win their Finals MVPs


SECTION 29 - Refuting 10 Myths About Michael Jordan
- Refuting certain myths about Jordan, as well as abridging of some of the main points in earlier sections for easier reference.


SECTION 30 - The 20 Greatest Conference Finals Runs of All-Time
- Ranking the 20 greatest playoff runs in which a player played 3 rounds before losing prior to the NBA Finals


SECTION 31 - The 1970s: The Weakest Decade of the NBA's Post-Infancy
- Why the 1970s was the weakest decade of any era from 1960-present


SECTION 32 - The 10 Worst Supporting Casts on NBA Finals Teams (1960-Present)
- Examining the worst supporting casts on teams that reached the NBA Finals


SECTION 33 - The 10 Greatest Rookie Playoff Runs of All-Time
- The most impressive playoff runs in which rookies led their team to at least one series win

12 comments:

  1. Question - How would you rate his post-defense game?

    Also, some say that MJ was overrated as a defender when he came back to Bulls after the first retirement by saying that he did not deserve the All-Defense Team Selections after he came back. What are your thoughts on that?

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    Replies
    1. Jordan's post defense was great. The misconception is that Jordan's post defense was weak just because Magic got the best of him in Game 1 and the beginning of Game 2 of the 1991 Finals. But in Game 3 after Pippen fouled out he held Magic to 0-0-0 in OT with 1 turnover.

      Penny also struggled to post him up in the 96 ECF, scoring only 1 point on Jordan the whole series. As a Wizard, Pierce and Vince also struggled to post him up and they were top 3 and top 7 scorers in the league that year - Vince would have been top 4 but his quad injury against the Spurs brought his numbers down. he had 25.8 ppg on 43% for 48 games pre-injury

      And he could guard centers and PFs for isolated possessions - it's not the same as guarding 1-5 but it shows good post defense

      Barkley - youtube.com/watch?v=GTUF-ImL7Zw
      Divac - youtube.com/watch?v=Esc0Ak9Jb90&feature=youtu.be&t=354
      Laettner - youtube.com/watch?v=dGuDdoYZXbQ

      And Jordan absolutely deserved all-defense from 96-98. This is backed up by his defense in the playoffs against Tim Hardaway, Penny Hardaway, Gary Payton, Rod Strickland, 20 ppg Steve Smith, John Stockton, and shutting down Reggie to 0 points in the 4th quarter of Game 7

      Before his knee injury in 2001/02, Jordan was also playing at the level of a first-team defender at age 38, all the stats are included in this article

      2001 Wizards = 2nd worst in ppg allowed the year before.

      Up to the injury game
      2002 Wizards = allowed 92.2 ppg through 47 games (Jordan missed 1 game)
      - would be tied for 6th-best in the league with the Pistons.

      2002 Wizards = allowed 92.0 ppg in the 46 games Jordan played
      - would be tied for 5th best in the league with the Nets

      After Jordan's injury
      2002 Wizards = allowed 96.8 ppg in the remaining 35 games
      - would be ranked 19th in the league
      - and fell to 11th in ppg allowed for the overall season.

      Jordan's defensive impact was improving as the season went on before his injury

      The Wizards started the season off slow with a 2-9 start
      - and allowed 98.4 ppg during the 2-9 start
      - on pace for 5th worst in the league

      In Jordan's last 35 games pre-injury after the 2-9 start
      - the Wizards allowed 90.0 ppg
      - on pace for 3rd best in the league

      When Jordan and Rip Hamilton played together, they were 15-1 in their last 16 games together up to the injury

      - The Wizards allowed 86.3 ppg in that 15-1 stretch
      - Easily on pace for the best in the league
      - The 2002 Heat were number 1 at 88.7 ppg allowed

      Rip played 78 games the previous year and the Wizards were still 2nd worst in ppg allowed.

      The 2001 Wizards' opponents shot 47.0%, 3rd worst in the league

      Through their first 47 games pre-Jordan's injury (Jordan missed 1 game)
      - The 2002 Wizards' opponents shot 44.3%
      - on pace for 11th best in the league

      In the 35 games post-Jordan's injury
      - The 2002 Wizards' opponents shot 46.4%
      - on pace for 2nd worst in the league (0.0001% worse than the Suns)

      And under Jordan, the Wizards improved on holding opponents to low FG% as the season went on

      Wizards got off to a slow 2-9 start to begin the season
      - The Wizards' opponents shot 46.8%
      - on pace for worst in the league

      In the Wizards last 36 games pre-Jordan injury (Jordan missed 1 game)
      - The Wizards' opponents shot 43.6%
      - on pace for 8th best in the league

      The Wizards were 15-1 in the last 16 games that Jordan and Rip Hamilton played together prior to Jordan's knee injury
      - The Wizards' opponents shot 41.7% in that 15-1 stretch
      - Easily on pace for best in the league
      - The 2002 Lakers held opponents to a league best 42.4%

      So unless 38-year old, cracked ribs and tendinitis knee Jordan was somehow better on defense than 96-98 Jordan, there's no objective argument to be made that he didn't deserve 1st-team defense or was an overrated defender

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  2. Where would you rank MJ as an overall defender? Does he have a strong case to be within the top 10?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I wouldn't say top 10 because the best defensive big man always contribute more on defense. In no particular order I would have to rank these guys ahead of him
      - Russell
      - Rodman
      - Hakeem
      - Mutombo
      - Ben Wallace
      - Alonzo
      - Duncan
      - Thurmond
      - Eaton
      - Robinson
      - Garnett
      - Ewing
      - Dwight

      I would put him in the top 15 overall defenders though. Kareem was always lit up by other big men in the playoffs and Wilts teams allowed the most points in the league in back to back prime seasons in 1962 and 1963, so they aren't as good defensively as the above guys

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  3. Sounds reasonable.

    What would you say was MJ's weakness in defense?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Honestly, with no exaggeration, he didn't really have any consistent weakness on defense. He was excellent at guarding smaller and quicker PGs, his effect on team defense was great as seen in the Wizard example, his post defense was great, and help defense was excellent. His off-ball defense was great which is why he had success shutting down all-time great shooters like Reggie and Peja and his defense on screens and pick n rolls was also great.

      His post defense was probably where he got beaten more often than the other areas of defense, but as explained above it wasn't a consistent liability. The only improvement he could make on defense is if he could guard 1-5 like Rodman, but that's not realistic considering Rodman is the only player who could do that in the first place.

      Some people claim that he gambled for steals and blocks too much, which led to his team getting burned but that clearly isn't the case given that pretty much every player he guarded in the playoffs went below their averages, or they caught fire whenever Jordan wasn't on him and struggled with him on them like Penny in 96

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  4. Thanks for the analysis.

    How about his rebounding?

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    Replies
    1. His rebounding was also great for a SG. He led the Bulls in rebounds for the last 3 rounds of the 1997 Playoffs (tied with Rodman) and nearly for all 4 rounds (0.53 rpg) along with the other 4 main categories. As I've mentioned before Hakeem is the only other player to do that on a title team when he led them in 5/5 for all 4 rounds in 1994

      Jordan averaged at least 6+ rpg in 8 different playoff runs past the 1st round, 10 total including his 1st round exits in 1986 and 1987.

      http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=total&type=totals&per_minute_base=36&per_poss_base=100&lg_id=NBA&is_playoffs=Y&year_min=&year_max=&franch_id=&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&height_min=0&height_max=99&shoot_hand=&birth_country_is=Y&birth_country=&birth_state=&college_id=&draft_year=&is_active=&debut_yr_nba_start=&debut_yr_nba_end=&debut_yr_aba_start=&debut_yr_aba_end=&is_hof=&is_as=&as_comp=gt&as_val=&award=&pos_is_g=Y&pos_is_gf=Y&qual=&c1stat=trb_per_g&c1comp=gt&c1val=6&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&c5stat=&c5comp=gt&c6mult=1.0&c6stat=&order_by=g

      The only guard with more 6+ rpg runs past the first round is Magic Johnson with 9 (11 total including 81 and 96 1st round exits). Kidd and Drexler have more total runs with 6+ rpg (12 each), but only 4 and 5 past the 1st round, respectively

      And he did that while playing against teams with great front courts (Ewing, Barkley, Alonzo, Shaq, Malone, Blazers, Pistons) and while having good rebounders on his own team in Pip, Grant, and Rodman to take boards away from him. When Rodman and Pippen's rebounding (and overall production) went down in 1997, he compensated and averaged a personal playoff-best 7.9 rpg for the whole playoffs at age 34.

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  5. "To seal the deal as to who was the better defender between Jordan and Pippen, one only has to look at Game 7 of the 1998 ECF. With the season on the line in Game 7, Jordan was the one that guarded the Pacer's best player, red-hot Reggie Miller who had 22 points on 7/12 through 3 quarters, before getting shut down to 0 points in the 4th quarter by Jordan. If Pippen really was the better defender than Jordan, then Phil would have put his trust in letting Pippen shut down Reggie in the 4th quarter with the entire season on the line. But that wasn't the case"

    Others may argue that Pippen may not have been the best choice due to his back problems affecting his performance. This is not to discredit Jordan in any way at all because it still shows that Jordan could be as good as Pippen, if not better, when needed.

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  6. In terms of on-ball and off-ball defense, can you do a quick comparison between Payton, Pippen, and Jordan?

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    Replies
    1. I think Jordan's on and off ball was the best of the 3.

      I think Paytons on ball was better than Pippen's, but Pippen's off ball was better than Paytons

      Blocks and steals aren't the end all be all of defense, but Pippen and MJ are the only ones with Hakeem to have 200-100 steals-blocks in a season, and MJ did it twice.

      All 3 of those guys have a strong case to being the best at their position defensively, so it's not coincidence they are the only ones to do that.

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  7. Just a question regarding the 1996 finals: To what extent did MJ play defense on Gary Payton, besides games 3 and 5? Did he also play full-out defense on him in game 4?

    ReplyDelete